Joint Public Health: Oct. 8, 2025

Representative Jeff Wardlaw We’ll go ahead and get started. We’ll start first things first. Senator Wallace, if you would lead us in prayer. 

Senator Dave Wallace Lord, thank you for this day. Thank you for our friends and colleagues who have gathered here together. Give us the strength and the knowledge that we may rule the state of Arkansas in thy will. Lord, please watch over our military. Watch over our loved ones. In Jesus’ name, amen. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Thank you, senator. Members, I have a motion to approve the minutes. You’re approving minutes from August 6th, September 10th, and September 11th. Got a motion. Do I have a second? I have a second. All those in favor, say aye. All opposed. Ayes have it. 

We’ll move on to item C, overview of hiring procedures at the Human Development Centers. If we could get Director Brezee to the table. Members, I’m going to let them present. We’ll ask them questions and then we have a number of witnesses in the crowd signed up. So we’ll go through those one by one. Miss Weatherton and Miss Brezee, if you guys would introduce yourself for the record, and you’re recognized to start. 

Jennifer Brezee Thank you. Jennifer Brezee, Director of the Developmental Disabilities Division at DHS. 

Melissa Weatherton Good morning. I’m Melissa Weatherton. I’m the director for Medicaid specialty populations. 

Hiring Issues at Human Development Centers

Jennifer Brezee I’m not sure we prepared an exact presentation, but we can definitely speak to the hiring process right now, if that is what the committee would like to hear. So with the implementation of the new pay plan, we’ve had to become more aware of our number of budgeted positions that we have in our budget. 

And we have started, I would say, we just haven’t had this issue before, which is a great issue to have with the implementation of the pay plan. We’ve definitely seen the number of applications and people wanting to come work for us increase, and so that’s been very positive. 

But with that increase, we’ve had to slow down a little bit and make sure that what we’re advertising and hiring is not going over that number. When a position is vacated today, we have to wait for that vacated position to clear our system. And then our staff creates a new requisition in AR Careers, which then goes to our HR committee, which reviews those weekly for approval. 

Once approved, that position then goes back to the hiring manager at the Human Developmental Center for them to approve, and that creates the job posting that is then posted on AR Careers. And then I will take questions. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Representative Ladyman, you’re recognized.

Representative Jack Ladyman Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you all for being here. You know, I feel like we need to have this discussion because there are a lot of people that have called members of this committee about what’s going on at the HDCs. So my question, you talked about– well, let me ask you this. What is the difference between budgeted positions and unbudgeted positions? I mean, what’s the difference there and what changed? 

Jennifer Brezee So, before, my understanding is that with the unbudgeted positions, we were still able to put people there, but that was more to keep the process moving a lot quicker. We always had that number of total positions unbudgeted. But with the unbudgeted positions, we were able, I think, to more quickly advertise and get those positions in our system that we use to manage those. 

With the implementation of the pay plan, we had to pause and make sure that all of our people in those unbudgeted positions were put under a budgeted position. So it’s very weedy, but it has to do with our system and how we manage those positions. And we had to stop using those unbudgeted positions in our system. 

Representative Jack Ladyman Okay. So what I’m hearing is that if someone leaves a position and the process that you just described takes a lot longer, so they can’t fill that position as quickly. And it might be a position that’s like a direct care position that needs to be filled right away, almost like an emergency, and that’s causing a problem in the HDCs covering the necessary positions at the site. So how long does that process take that you just described? 

Jennifer Brezee So it takes anywhere around five business days from the team’s feedback for a vacated position to clear out from the system. And then as soon as that is clear in our system, the HR staff is able to create a new requisition. And then those new requisitions go to our weekly HR meeting. And so that happens normally on Tuesdays. 

And then the team looks at– I think agency-wide– so it’s not just DDS. They’re looking at all positions. And then those positions that are approved are approved within 24 hours. And then that goes back to the recruiting manager at the HDC. And then they’re able to approve that for posting almost immediately. 

Representative Jack Ladyman Okay. But if you’ve got direct care people in the home and they can’t fill that position for five days and they don’t have these extra people that they used to have, that’s a problem. So are there any positions like direct care that are exempt from this process where a site superintendent in an emergency situation could hire someone to be a direct care worker at a house. Is there an exemption for that? 

Jennifer Brezee There’s not an exemption, but we do have several nursing contracts that the HDCs are still able to use, which would include our CNAs, our direct care positions. And so the superintendents can utilize one of several contracts if we need someone out there ASAP. 

Representative Jack Ladyman Mr. Chairman, one more and then I’ll let someone else talk. But is it true that at the Boonville facility that the work center is shut down due to lack of staff? 

Jennifer Brezee I do believe that we’ve had to shift some of those staff that were doing training into direct care to fill some needs while we’re hiring. 

Representative Jack Ladyman Do you know what kind of issues that’s caused with the clients at Boonville? 

Jennifer Brezee I do not directly, no. 

Representative Jack Ladyman Okay. Well, I think that’s something that we really need to look into. Mr. Chairman, I’ll get on later. Thank you. 

Jennifer Brezee Yeah, you’re welcome. Thank you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Representative Johnson, you’re recognized. 

Budgeted vs. Unbudgeted Positions

Representative Lee Johnson Thank you, Mr. Chairman. So I’m hearing some things that I don’t understand. So you’re saying there are unbudgeted positions and budgeted positions, and you’re trying to now have to convert the unbudgeted positions to budgeted positions? 

Jennifer Brezee Yes. 

Representative Lee Johnson Help me understand why you would have unbudgeted positions anyway. I thought that all positions would probably be a part of the budgeted process. And if we have unbudgeted, is there more now in budgeted? Or how does that work, I guess, is my first question? 

Melissa Weatherton So this is, I mean, this is not new to this year. So in our appropriations for each one of the divisions, there are authorized positions for each one of our divisions. 

Representative Lee Johnson I don’t mean to interrupt, but now I’m hearing a third term. 

Melissa Weatherton I know. 

Representative Lee Johnson So is authorized budgeted or is authorized both budgeted and unbudgeted? 

Melissa Weatherton Both budgeted and unbudgeted. So we have an authorized position number in each one of our divisions that then each year goes in, and based on the budget, we budget out of that total number what our salary line item can afford. So there is a series of budgeted positions and then there’s a pool of unbudgeted positions. 

Representative Lee Johnson That decision as to what’s budgeted and not budgeted, is that made within the agency or is that made as a legislative decision? I mean, I understand we control the budget, we control how much money we put in the space, but I would think that– I don’t know, I guess I’m just trying to understand again the idea of budgeted versus unbudgeted and how that decision is made to divide these authorized positions into some centers have budgeted and unbudgeted. Is that, again, is that an executive decision that’s made? Or is that a legislative decision? 

Melissa Weatherton I mean, it’s solely based on the amount of money we receive. 

Representative Lee Johnson So do you have a delta between the different facilities? So do some facilities have a certain number of unbudgeted, big air quotes, versus– how are you deciding facility to facility what the proportion of budgeted to unbudgeted is? How are you deciding how to allocate that finite resource of the money from space to space? 

Melissa Weatherton Absolutely. So in the DDS budget, DDS as a whole gets RSA funding from you guys in our appropriation. And so there is no such thing really as a Conway HDC position or a Booneville position. They’re DDS positions. 

So, for example, out of our budgeted positions that we have this year, we only have 100 people that work at DDS Central, right, running the waivers and running all of the programs. And the rest of our staff are out in the facility. So year over year, we’ve made a conscious decision to continue to do less people in central office and shift more people to the human development centers because that is our priority. 

Representative Lee Johnson So do you have an idea of how many unfilled authorized positions you have? I guess that’s the question I would really ask, per facility. 

Melissa Weatherton So not per facility, but I can give you the DD S numbers in totality. 

Representative Lee Johnson Maybe staff can get that to me. I’ll step out. I know that there’s other questions, but I do think I’m going to want to ask more questions about this to understand it better. Because I don’t really understand– I don’t have a visual as to how many unbudgeted positions are out there and then how are you changing your allocation of funding? Your funding’s finite. How are you changing that allocation now to decide you’re going to move some unbudgeted to budgeted? 

Melissa Weatherton We set that in PBAS each year before the year. 

Representative Lee Johnson Oh, that’s a big word. You’re going to have to help me with that one. 

Melissa Weatherton And I wish I knew what it stood for. And I should. 

Representative Lee Johnson Tell me what it is. 

Melissa Weatherton I don’t know. 

Representative Lee Johnson Acronyms– people out there that know me, the acronyms are my thing. I’m going to ask if I don’t know what it is. 

Melissa Weatherton So it’s the portal that we go in and enter all of our budgets across, okay? 

Representative Lee Johnson What’s it called again? 

Melissa Weatherton PBAS.

Representative Lee Johnson Anybody? 

Melissa Weatherton No idea. 

Representative Lee Johnson I’m open to members to help explain. There’s people who’ve been here longer than me. Okay, go ahead. We’ll look that up later. 

Melissa Weatherton So in that system, before the new state fiscal year begins, we go in, based on the budget, and we enter the number of positions that the budget will afford. So in the DDS appropriation, for example, in 2026, we have 2,490 authorized positions. We have 1,965 budgeted.

Representative Lee Johnson And that’s for all of DDS? That’s not broken down by facility. That’s any position. This doesn’t really have anything specific to do with the HDCs. They’re just part of your budgeted, sorry, authorized positions. And we don’t micromanage how you decide which ones to fill, which ones not to fill. 

Melissa Weatherton That’s right. You don’t. And what we have done and what we are doing right now is we have around 100 staff that are outside of the HDCs running all the rest of the DD programs. 

Representative Lee Johnson Okay. I’ll get back in the queue and let other people ask some questions. 

Senator Missy Irvin So, members, we’ll contact fiscal division to come and answer your questions from BLR. The personnel committee analyst should know all that information and details for you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw We’ve requested them to come over, so they should be here in a few minutes. With that, Representative Bentley. 

Contract Nurses vs. Staffed

Representative Mary Bentley Thank you, Chairman, right here. You know, our hopes as a legislature was that when we did the pay plan that we would decrease the number of contract nurses in these facilities, that our patients would have more stability and have long term staff. So I’m concerned that we don’t see that playing out. Can you tell me what the percentage is right now of contract nursing nurses, staff, CNA, whatever, in our HDC facilities? 

Jennifer Brezee Thank you. We don’t have a percentage, but I can tell you that we have been able to successfully hire some more RNs and LPNs, so about five additional RNs and then a handful of LPNs. We compared this quarter contract spend to this time last year, and we’re about $10,000 less in contract spend for this quarter than we were last year. We still have 24 vacant LPN positions that are posted, and 11 vacant RN positions that are posted, and one APRN position that is posted. 

Representative Mary Bentley And are those specifically for the HDCs or are those across the board? 

Jennifer Brezee They are. 

Representative Mary Bentley So contrary to things we hear out in the media, we’re still in desperate need of LPNs in the state of Arkansas. Would you agree with that? 

Jennifer Brezee I would agree. And we have seen an increase in applications. It’s just we still need more. 

Representative Mary Bentley Director Brezee, how long have you been in this position that you’re in now? 

Jennifer Brezee One year and four months. 

Representative Mary Bentley One year and four months. Okay. In that time, have you been out each one of our HDCs and toured them and visited with the staff out there? 

Jennifer Brezee I have. 

Booneville Vo Tech Shutdown

Representative Mary Bentley So I’m just concerned what we’re hearing about in Boonville with the vo tech shutting down because it is a huge– I mean, as I’ve toured other ones at my district, it’s such a happy place for them to go and have meaningful input each day and to really add great value to their lives. So it concerns me that shut down. Do we know when we’ll be able to open up the vo tech to get that up and running to help those clients there to enjoy their daily lives again? 

Jennifer Brezee Hopefully soon. We have had over 30 positions approved in the last couple of weeks and so we are seeing the process become a lot smoother now that we’ve cleared up the budgeted versus unbudgeted and then getting requisitions. Things are just happening faster now. 

Representative Mary Bentley One more follow up. So that soon, maybe 30 days, 60 days, just give us– 

Jennifer Brezee I just don’t know because the training process and the onboarding process does take a while, which is so important for our staff that are taking care of our individuals. And so phase class can last anywhere for two weeks. And then to do the additional CNA training, that can take another 30 days. And so it can be a six to eight week process to get someone fully trained and onboarded to start taking care of folks. 

Representative Mary Bentley Okay. Thank you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw So you guys are overseen by the Office of Long Term Care, correct? 

Jennifer Brezee We are. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw So they can write you the same tags they write any nursing home or hospital in the state, correct? 

Jennifer Brezee Yes, sir. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw So under your current staffing levels, do you meet the requirements of long term care off of the residents that you have in your facilities today? 

Jennifer Brezee As far as I’m aware, we do. And that’s what we strive for every shift is to make sure we’re fully staffed to meet ratios. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw So that would answer the question earlier about Booneville. That’s the reason you closed that particular section down is because you didn’t meet that staffing level. Correct? 

Jennifer Brezee I’m certain that that was part of the reasons is we needed to shift staff to make sure we maintain ratios. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Representative Rose, you’re recognized.

Representative Ryan Rose Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Over here on your right. Thank you. A couple of questions. I want to go back to a little bit of the discussion we had earlier with regards to the Booneville Center and some other things that you’d said. So you’d been asked about staffing and being able to hire people, and there was some kind of an answer that was, yes, we’re able to hire people, yes, we have enough staff to do these things, and to cover when, I think it was move maybe some nursing and staffing around when a vacancy takes place. 

I was trying to get back to where we were. That you felt competent in we can move people, we can fill these vacancies. But then just a couple moments later, we were in discussion about the Booneville Center, and it was, well, we had to shut down the vocational training facility to shift staff to fill vacancies. 

So to me, it sounds like those were two conflicting answers. Yes, we have enough staff to move in a vacancy, but, oh, we had to close down this training program to shift staff. I kept hearing the word shift, shift. So can you reconcile those two things for me? You have enough staff to fill vacancies, but then you have to shut something down to fill vacancies, which sounds like you don’t have enough staff. 

Jennifer Brezee So I think it’s two things. So to maintain our staff to client ratios, we did have to move some staff that were doing the trainings to make sure that we’re meeting those client care ratios while we are still advertising and trying to hire folks and get them on board. 

Melissa Weatherton I would add that I think the shift from no longer being able to put people in unbudgeted positions, and we had around 100 people in unbudgeted positions this summer, and so when we were given the directive to quit using unbudgeted positions, we had to pause because we had to then move those individuals into the same types of grades into budgeted positions. 

And from what I can tell looking back at the time frames and talking to staff, that took around three weeks. And when you’re not hiring people for three weeks, right, because we’re just moving people that we already had to a different position and hiring was paused, and we’re bringing in anywhere from about 20-25 people every week is what we’ve been approving, we got behind. 

And so what we’ve been seeing the last, I would say, three weeks is we’re back in business. And those requests are coming through and we are approving them in totality as they come through each week. But to have that kind of three week kind of pause on hiring was hurtful. 

Representative Ryan Rose So would it be correct– I’m making sure I’m understanding your testimony correctly. Would it be correct to say that you feel like presently you have the staff to fill vacancies, but it was during the summer that presented an issue where you got behind. And that’s why the shift took place and had to close the vocational program at the Booneville facility, for example. That was a problem at a moment during the summer that is not a problem now? Is that what you’re saying? Because you don’t have this pause that took place? 

Melissa Weatherton I would not solely place on just that one issue. I think there have been a couple of things that have occurred. 

Representative Ryan Rose So is there still a present issue then? What I’m trying to figure out is earlier you said you had enough staff to fill the vacancies. That was said, that, hey, we’ve got enough staff to fill these vacancies. But then we’re closing down programs to fill vacancies, which says to me we don’t have enough staff. So I’m still trying to figure out because those two answers conflict with one another. 

Melissa Weatherton So I think it’s the word vacancy here, and I’m sorry if I made this more confusing. So we have vacant positions right now that we are advertising. And we have more vacant positions that we need to be advertising, right? We have not hit our budgeted position cap. 

So we, I would not say right now, like, we’re staffed to capacity. Because you’re right. If we were staffed to capacity, we wouldn’t be closing down units. What I’m saying is, I think,  over the summer with a couple of different systematic changes, we lost some ground for a couple of weeks where we would normally have been bringing in 20, 30 people each week. And now we’re playing catch up. 

Representative Ryan Rose Along this same vein, and then I’ll hop out after this, I don’t want to dominate the conversation. You were answering a couple of questions that Representative Bentley had asked. And I’ve got small kids and teenagers, and so I’m very comfortable using broad terms that can mean a wide answer, like yes, we’ll do that sometime, or we’ll get together soon. 

And so I kind of want to go back to, you used the terminology of, yes, we’re going to have that resolved soon. But then when pressed, it was, well, onboarding takes a while, this could be six to eight weeks. I’m curious if you could qualify the timeline still. 

Because when you say soon, like Representative Bentley, I’m like, 30 days, 60 days, 90 days? I heard, well,  all these people haven’t been hired, it’s going to take at least two months to train them. That doesn’t sound soon. So I’m just curious, can you give us a ballpark of what soon looks like? 

Melissa Weatherton We can go back and look and see how many positions we have been approving week over week since we fixed the unbudgeted versus budgeted situation. But you’re right, from the moment we bring a staff member in the door, I would say it is six weeks until they hit the floor because of the training. 

Representative Ryan Rose Would it, and I’ll jump out after this, would it be more appropriate at this time to say it’s undetermined when that vocational program will be back up and running in Booneville? We’re not sure when?

Melissa Weatherton I would have to go back and see five weeks ago how many people we onboarded at Booneville and where they are in the training. 

Representative Ryan Rose So uncertain at this time. Moving towards it, but not sure. 

Melissa Weatherton I think that’s fair. 

Representative Ryan Rose Okay, thank you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw So before I come to Representative Johnson who is next in the queue, the Bureau is here to testify. I would say the Bureau is not prepared to testify on the exact numbers at DHS because they didn’t know they were going to testify. 

So I think that’s important for members to know as you’re asking these questions. So don’t get frustrated if Tony don’t know the exact numbers of each human development center or DHS in general. So with that, I’m going to go to Representative Johnson. 

Representative Lee Johnson Sure. So does the staff want to come and try to answer the questions? 

Tony Robinson Tony Robinson, Bureau of Legislative Research. 

Representative Lee Johnson Thank you, Tony, for coming. 

Tony Robinson Yes, sir. 

Authorized and Budgeted Positions

Representative Lee Johnson Impromptu to try to help educate us. So I guess what I’m trying to get around to, it sounds like that they have authorized positions for DDS, but that’s not necessarily broken down into authorized positions specifically for the HDCs. 

Tony Robinson No, sir. In DDS, the way I’m going to break down just the process real quick. So during regular session, the General Assembly establishes an appropriation bill, okay? And they give an agency like DHS, and DDS may have its own individual appropriation bill, appropriated positions. That’s their total authorized number of positions that they can use. 

Within that, following the legislative session, the agencies go through an AOP, annual operation process. During that time, they take the money or the funding that is given to them and they determine how many positions that they can utilize of their total at any given time. So that sets apart your budgeted from your unbudgeted. 

Representative Lee Johnson And that amount of funding that’s concurrent with the appropriation bill, is that through RSA? Or is that through the separate funding bill that we do now in conjunction with RSA? 

Tony Robinson I think it’s going to be in conjunction with. 

Representative Lee Johnson So it’s not the RSA necessarily that describes that funding. It’s the new process we kind of have in place where we pass a funding bill that connects the RSA. 

Tony Robinson And I don’t want to get out of my bounds because I’m a personnel guy, I’m not a budget fiscal guy. So I think it’s going to be in conjunction of both, because for the positions, whatever you fund them, they have to be able to pay for those positions. So they can utilize any of the positions they have within the context of the amount of money that you’re giving them, if I’m making sense. 

Representative Lee Johnson You are. 

Tony Robinson Now once they set that, once the AOP is set and you have a group of unbudgeted positions and a group of budgeted positions, they can utilize some of those unbudgeted positions if they turn around and unuse some of the positions that have been budgeted. So they can kind of mix and match as they need to at times.

 But that’s a process that the agencies have to go through with DFA and DTSS to make that happen. So there is a path that they have to follow. And each agency is going to be a little bit different. And DHS, I’m quite sure, because of their size, is going to be an even bigger path. 

Representative Lee Johnson Okay, I think I understand that. So there’s, after the session, each agency has some sort of planning. What did you call it again? 

Tony Robinson Yes, sir. 

Representative Lee Johnson The AO–? 

Tony Robinson Annual operations plan. 

Representative Lee Johnson Yeah. And in that process they decide, they have the discretion in conjunction with DFA and other people within the executive branch to decide how they’re going to utilize the money they have for the positions authorized. And in that process, they determine that some of the jobs are unbudgeted, i.e., we’re not going to fill those. 

Tony Robinson Correct. 

Representative Lee Johnson We’re not going to pay for those. 

Tony Robinson That’s correct. 

Representative Lee Johnson Because we don’t have the money to pay for those unbudgeted positions. In this process this year the decision was made to create unbudgeted positions at the HDCs. 

Tony Robinson Yes, sir. And that’s going to be, every agency always that some unbudgeted positions. 

Representative Lee Johnson Right, but is it always at the HDC? Okay. So always every year, we decide some of the people that are working at the HDC, we’re just going to lay them off? Because if they’re unbudgeted, how are you going to pay for it? 

Tony Robinson An unbudgeted position just means that there is no cost to the state at the time for an unbudgeted position. If a position has been budgeted, whether or not it’s filled, okay, if a position is budgeted, you’re going to pay insurance on that position. So that’s number one. You don’t pay retirement on a position until the position is actually filled. On an unbudgeted position, you’re not paying insurance or retirement. 

Now if they switch and use an unbudgeted position, it is my understanding that once they fill that position, they will then begin paying insurance and retirement on that position to EBD. But it’s the starting point. That unbudgeted and budgeted, it’s a starting point at the AOP process. Then as they move throughout the year, they can undo, they can take a position that was budgeted, unbudgeted it, and then take an unbudgeted position and budget it. 

Representative Lee Johnson Somehow I think I may have followed that. We can have a discussion offline. I don’t mean to take up committee time educating us on things. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw I think I can add something to that. So, Madam Director, you’re not filling any unbudgeted positions right now, correct? 

Jennifer Brezee That’s correct. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw You’re not even touching that. 

Jennifer Brezee That’s correct. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw You’re not even close to filling your budget positions, correct? 

Jennifer Brezee That’s correct. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw So I want to make that clear. Unbudgeted isn’t even a part of this. 

Representative Lee Johnson But I don’t understand. Then that does bring up another question. Like do you have people working currently at the HDC that are working in unbudgeted positions? 

Jennifer Brezee That was part of the pause this summer as we moved those 100 people. 

Representative Lee Johnson So you had people that were working after your AOP that were working at HDCs that you made the financial decision to have those positions that were budgeted before become unbudgeted and then you had to move these actual–

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Hold on. Hold on. Representative, I think that’s where you’re missing the boat. 

Representative Lee Johnson Yeah. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Quit using the word unbudgeted. They’re not even touching unbudgeted positions. They’re not filling all of their budgeted positions. And they’re using money from budgeted positions to fill the gap for the new pay plan, correct? 

Melissa Weatherton So we have always been able to utilize both unbudgeted and budgeted positions. So I think I mentioned earlier, our budgeted position number is 1,965. Okay? As long as we did not go over 1,965 bodies, regardless of what type of position we put you in, we could move people back and forth. All right. They got paid. I mean, this unbudgeted versus budgeted is something we do in PBAS, right, to hit our budget. So as long as we stayed within budget and we stayed within the budgeted amount of people, we were fine. We could put them in unbudgeted or budgeted. So it gave us some flexibility to churn faster. 

Representative Lee Johnson So to be clear though, you had people in unbudgeted. 

Melissa Weatherton Mm-hmm. They were being paid. 

Representative Lee Johnson Yeah, that was the impression I got. They just weren’t– now, to your point, you had actual people, not just open positions that were unbudgeted. They just weren’t getting insurance and–? 

Melissa Weatherton Well, they were getting everything. So it’s just a designation that we do in our own planning system. 

Representative Lee Johnson There are people who are working for DHS who are unbudgeted? 

Melissa Weatherton There were. 

Representative Lee Johnson But we’re fixing that because we’re having to move them. And these are actual people, not just openings?

Melissa Weatherton Yes. So regardless of whether we had you in an unbudgeted position or a budgeted position, for our planning purposes, it did not affect anything about their benefits or their pay. We were just able to put people in open positions as long as we didn’t exceed our budgeted cap amount. 

Now they have, this summer, they said, please stop doing that. Just put people in budgeted positions. So you have a position with a position number on it. And so I have to put you in that CNA position with that position number that’s budgeted in our system. I can’t put you in another CNA position over here. Even though we haven’t hit our cap and we’re still under the 1,965, I can’t put you in one of the unbudgeted. I have to put you in a budgeted. 

And because we had to pause and clean that up this summer, because that was a shift in how we’ve always done this, it was about a three-week lag where I had to move 100 people into budgeted CNA positions or housekeeping positions or whatever they do for us at the HDCs. We had to take the time to pause. So we weren’t accidentally hiring new people into the positions. We were trying to move these people into. And that caused caused a delay in the amount of people we were hiring each week. 

Representative Lee Johnson I think I understand. Thank you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Representative Ladyman. 

Representative Jack Ladyman Thank you, Mr Chair. Well, this is getting very confusing to me. I don’t know about everybody else. But yeah, Jennifer, I knew you had been here a while. But you and I shared a stage at Jonesboro. I didn’t think it’d been a year, but maybe it has. But maybe one of y’all can answer this question. So you have 24 LPN and 11 RN positions not filled. And I know you said you didn’t have the exact numbers. Maybe you do. But where these are, are most of those in like Arkadelphia and Conway, or do you know? 

Jennifer Brezee I don’t know, but we can get that for you. 

Work Opportunities at HDCs

Representative Jack Ladyman Okay, if you would. The work center being closed down at Booneville bothers me a lot. Jennifer, when you were in Jonesboro, I don’t know whether you had time to tour the work center there or not. But if you did, you probably saw how those people really enjoy working. You know, I worked in factories. I wish I had some of these people working in the factories I worked in because they like to work. 

Jennifer Brezee Agree. 

Representative Jack Ladyman And they’re at work every day. We’re here talking about things– let’s talk about those people in those homes. They’re in this home with, I don’t know, 10, 12 other people. They have no parents, no family there. They eat their meals and they sit in the shared room and watch Gunsmoke, you know. And then they’re able to go to classes and other things. 

But if they’re not able to do work, which to them is one of the most important, maybe the most important, thing they do in the whole day. And these people in Booneville have not been able to do that. That’s been taken away from them. And in some cases, these are mentally 5-year-olds that are in a 60-year-old body. And when that happens, they get upset. I’m sure they do. But it’s so important to them. 

So I don’t understand when you say you’ve got budget positions not filled, yet we shut down a work center. I don’t understand how that can happen. Why do we not take some of those positions that are not filled and fill them and put them in the work center? 

Jennifer Brezee We are definitely working to get that done. And I agree a hundred percent, Representative Ladyman, how important it is to keep folks active and to give them purpose. And that training and those employment activities are so important. 

Representative Jack Ladyman I think that’s one of the best things we can do for these people to give them value and worth. So what can we do as a legislature to help this situation? I mean, what can we do to help you make this work better? Because it needs to work better. Do you have any suggestions? 

Senator Missy Irvin I’d like to answer that. We passed a bill this past session that started an LPN school. Representative Bentley and I were the sponsors of that bill. We have to have more people in the pipeline. We have to have more people that they can hire that are trained to do this job. And that is something that we have responded to. They worked with us. Long term care, the Office of Long Term Care, worked with the long term care industry, who are here in the audience with us today. And the industry started new LPN schools, and we were able to sponsor that legislation. So Representative Ladyman, that is a really great thing that this legislature has done in the process of trying to get that started. But I have a question when you’re done. 

Representative Jack Ladyman Let me finish my question. Madam Chair, that’s not exactly what I was talking about. What I’m talking about are the people that supervise these folks in the working center, the people that cook their meals, make their beds, wash their clothes, sweep the floor. I mean, these are really good dedicated people. And that’s the people we’re talking about here, not the nurses. 

You know, we’re talking about the people that are direct care. And I don’t know whether I can, but at the end of this, I may make a motion to exempt those folks from this whole process. Because if they’re cooking meals for 16 people and they leave and you don’t have anybody, then they don’t eat. Their beds are not made. Their clothes are not washed. The floor’s not swept. They don’t get baths at night. 

We’re not talking about nurses or doctors or physical therapists here. We’re talking about the dedicated people that work in these houses to take care of these people. Is there anything we can do to help that situation? 

Melissa Weatherton I understand the distinction you’re making on this. And I understand. But every week we’re approving what the HDCs are requesting to be hired. And we have other budgeted vacant positions available that can be pushed forward to us to request to advertise and hire. 

So we’re not holding up what is being asked of us at each one of the facilities, except for, we am holding a psychologist position because I’m not going to run it for the seventh time, right? Because we’ve got no applicants. So back to what Senator Irvin  was talking about, we can put positions out there for some of these APRNs and psychologists and nurses, but it doesn’t mean they’re going to apply and it doesn’t mean we’re going to hire them. 

I will say to you that I think the CNA is a little different. That’s easier. More people are wanting that job, but we’re approving every single position request that’s coming through every week for advertisement. 

Representative Jack Ladyman So it sounds like it’s a timing issue that we need to really look at and try to fix. Since I’ve got the mic, I’m going to ask one quick question. Can I get a timeline on the construction at Jonesboro? I know that it’s gone out to bid or the bid package is being prepared. I need a new timeline on when we’re going to have a groundbreaking. 

Melissa Weatherton We sent that to Lori yesterday and she’s got that for you today. 

Representative Jack Ladyman Okay. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Thank you. 

Melissa Weatherton You’re welcome. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Senator Love, you’re recognized. 

Senator Fred Love Thank you, Mr. Chair.  So I’m trying to put this puzzle all together. We’re talking about staff shortages. We’re talking about what we’re doing. I heard the number of 2,411 and one as far as nursing. So but let me go back so I can understand something. You are approving positions that the HDCs are asking to actually be filled and then they are actually, they’re doing the filling themselves. And so in essence if the positions are not being filled, it’s because of the HDCs that are not filling the positions as far as hiring. I’m just talking about hiring. You’re looking at me. I’m wanting you to help me understand this process. 

Melissa Weatherton I think one of the key other changes that occurred over the summer that is affecting this is, as Director Brezee mentioned at the beginning we’ve always had a budget at DD. We’ve always had a budgeted position cap that we were staying with under. But we didn’t have enough applicants to even worry about it, right, that we were ever going to exceed it or meet it or get anywhere close to it. 

And so when the pay plan went into effect, we were swarmed with applicants. So then we had to start looking at it more carefully. So back then, before the summer, we did continuous advertisement. Those things were on our website. They were always open. The positions were always open. People could apply any time. And so we had, I think, 50 or 60 people apply right after the pay plan went into effect. 

And we thought, oh goodness, we can’t leave these positions up continuously advertised because we’re going to hit that budgeted number really quickly. And so now the process has changed where they are having to request as somebody vacates. That also is playing into this. So I think it was just several different system changes at the same time that have caused this to drastically slow down starting July and August that we are now back and have a process going and are approving them as they come in each week. 

But if you’re not hiring– because let’s just say we lose 14 people across the HDCs each week. They’re either terminated or they don’t show back up. So we’re always 14 people quitting, 16 people coming in the door, right? I mean that’s just how they’ve always operated. Y’all know this, our turnover rates are really high. 

And so it’s just constant churn of quitting and hiring. And so when we had all kind those system changes happen over the summer, people were still quitting, but we weren’t bringing in the amount of people that were leaving. And so now we’re back on track. And so now we’re able to approve every week, but it’s going to take a minute to build it back up. 

Senator Fred Love Okay, so in your assessment, because I heard you say it takes six to eight weeks to get people kind of put in. And in your assessment, I guess when will we reach that– I mean, well, number one, have you done an assessment to say, Hey, within the next six months we will be where we need to be because one thing is this churn that’s going on. Have you all assessed that as to why we have just so much churn? 

Jennifer Brezee We do constantly look at that and we have the We Heart program. So I think the team recognized several years ago that there was a big churn, and so we’ve been implementing several what we call pillars to address the retention and retainment of employees. And that’s a report we send into the legislators, I think, every November, December. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Okay. So members, if we could silence the cellphones, it’s a little bit rude to have those ringing every five minutes. 

Senator Fred Love Thank you, Mr. Chair. So here’s the question I have. Have we done an assessment on that? You said yes. But number two is, have we done an assessment on when we feel like we’re going to have enough staff to kind of we’re stabilized? 

Jennifer Brezee I do think that we’ll hit our budgeted number within the next six months for sure, if not sooner. 

Senator Fred Love That means that there will not be any more contract nurses? Or you will still have the contract nurses and the staff? 

Jennifer Brezee I think our need for contracted nurses should continue to go down. But as I think we’ve shared before, those positions have been harder to fill. 

Melissa Weatherton And it’s not just on the on-call contracts, Senator Love. It’s not just for LPNs and RNs. It’s also CNAs. So I think we’ll keep those contracts in place. So if we have CNAs not showing up and we’re trying to get coverage, we’ll have to utilize those on-call contracts. 

Senator Fred Love Okay, I guess the utilization of the on-call contracts is not really my issue. It’s that we upped the pay plan so that we could actually hire nursings or CNAs or whatever. And then if we’re utilizing the same amount of money and we’re utilizing it for the budgeted positions, then we actually didn’t save any money. We’re spending more money. 

Melissa Weatherton It is our intention to, as we continue to hire LPNs, RNs and CNAs, that we will see a drastic decrease of those contracts. And so that’s what we’re watching. It’s just, I don’t think it’s been enough time. So like what Director Brezee said, right now we’re only seeing $10,000 less used than we were at the same time last year. But as we continue to hire, and we’re watching it, that should go down, as well as our overtime spend should be going down. 

Senator Fred Love Okay. All right. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Senator Irvin. 

Senator Missy Irvin So I know because of our federal regulations that dictate a lot of what we do. How much of this has played into this? Because I know if you have a fire and the firemen need to go tend to the fire, it leaves limited people maintaining the fire station. 

So with that scenario, I understand or correct me if I’m wrong, how much was that a factor where we had to move people quickly because we had to make sure that we were meeting those very important ratios? And so it left us lean in other areas, service programs, things like that, where we didn’t have that strict regulation. 

Is that, am I understanding that correctly? Or can you elaborate on that? I’m specifically speaking about some of the work programs and things like that, understanding that there’s one area that’s highly regulated and dictated where another program area may not be. Am I understanding that correctly? 

Jennifer Brezee Yeah. I think so. And that’s what our superintendents are so great about is doing that assessment of what staff is required to meet our federal regs. But then there’s also the complexity of our individual members. And so we have some members that need one-to-one staffing, some members that don’t need such a high level of staffing. And so they have to take all of that into account, not only our federal regulations, but then what are just the individual needs of each person. 

Senator Missy Irvin And is that a daily assessment or–?

Jennifer Brezee Yes. People’s level could change on a daily, like someone could be having a behavior and needs more staffing for a short time period until they get more stable and then they can go back to less staff. 

Senator Missy Irvin Okay, so and that communication is with you on a daily basis with your superintendents? 

Jennifer Brezee The superintendents and the house staff for sure. 

Senator Missy Irvin Okay. And so a lot of that also played into this when we ran into this pause and hiring and the shift and all that. It just kind of snowballed. It was like a snowball effect. I just needed to also understand that. But I think it’s also very important that we understand we’ve got to make sure we’re meeting critical need as soon as possible. And that we are reflective in that decision making process at that superintendent level and also with the agency level and that is assessed daily and is communicated back. Okay, thank you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Senator Johnson. 

Senator Mark Johnson Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate you. Let me ask a question as a non-member of the committee. Madam Director, I appreciate the questions that my colleagues have already asked because many of them were the ones that I was here to learn about. 

But I guess I want to some kind of sew this all up to say today, do you see any need that the General Assembly needs to work, whether by regulation or some other kind of temporary funding or some waiver of some of the processes in training that we need to do to put you in the position where you need to be? 

I’m very knowledgeable of Conway’s situation. I grew up there. I knew people who lived there. And many of them in those days actually worked in jobs in the city. I don’t think you do it the same way anymore. 

But is there anything that short term and maybe even going into fiscal session that we need to consider and get the ball rolling to help y’all solve this? At first, I just thought it was a workforce problem. And we all know that sometimes it’s just a shortage of people. But is there something we can do collectively as a legislature to make sure that these people who are some of our most vulnerable are not left without the care they need? 

Jennifer Brezee I’ll defer to my boss. 

Melissa Weatherton All right. Thank you for that question. We are focused on hiring each week. And I’ll be frank, we need to bring 200 more staff on board. 

Senator Mark Johnson Statewide?

Melissa Weatherton At the five HDCs. It will still be within our budgeted number. And so that’s our focus is to continue to hire as quickly as we can to deploy 200 additional staff across the five HDCs and stay within our budgeted number of 1,965 and stay within our salaries. And we can do it. We’ve just got to move more each week, more people, more hiring phrases each week. 

Senator Mark Johnson Okay. Well then I trust you will get back with us if that situation changes and we need to do something here with the General Assembly, especially going into fiscal session, which is a time we’ll be starting budget hearings before very long. All right. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Representative Richardson. 

Representative Jay Richardson Thank you, Mr. Chair. Based on what you just said– I’m right here. The 200 positions that you have left to fill, what’s the dollar amount attached to that? Do you know off the top what those positions equate to in salary? 

Melissa Weatherton No, but I can get that for you. Because it’s mostly CNAs, and their salary just got raised. 

Representative Jay Richardson Okay. What is that? Tell me that. Do you know where it got raised to? 

Melissa Weatherton I do not, but I can get that for you. 

Representative Jay Richardson Thank you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Representative Ladyman. Yeah, I’m not ready for that. So you were next in the queue. And I’m sorry, just get back in. Representative Rose. 

Representative Ryan Rose Yes, sir. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Are there, similar to the vocational program at the Booneville Center, are there other programs similar to that or just other programs attached to the work that you guys oversee that have had to be either closed or temporarily postponed due to the system changes from this summer? 

Jennifer Brezee Not that I’m aware of at this time. But we can definitely check into that. 

Melissa Weatherton Each one of our HDCs has its own type of work program. So like what Representative Ladyman was talking about, they have a really cool greenhouse recycling center at Jonesboro called Greenworks. And then each one of our HDCs, the clients there make items that they sell at the Blue Umbrella that we opened about 5, 6 years ago. That’s at the base of the DHS building. 

It’s a really cool store if you haven’t ever been there. And all of the money goes back to the clients that make goods. So clients from the HDCs are still sending products to the Blue Umbrella. But we will definitely check to see if they’re not going as frequently or if they’ve had to stop one temporarily. And we can get that for you. 

Representative Ryan Rose So are there protocols that dictate when to close that? Because I heard somebody ask earlier if it was pertaining to ratio. And I think your response was that that was one aspect of how that decision was made. But are there other kind of protocols in place that when XYZ happens then we’re going to close these facilities because XYZ? 

Melissa Weatherton No, sir. I think a good example, so if there’s eight men clients living in a house, and depending on what their supervision level is– one could be one-on-one, one could be two-on-one because it’s all based on behaviors and needs. 

And so what if that eight-bed house for those men, in order to meet the ratios of those particular clients, needs four staff. And one person wants to go to the work program. But one staff can’t leave, right, to walk that one or two people to the work program because we won’t be meeting ratios in the house. 

Staff Shortage Numbers and Impacts

Representative Ryan Rose I follow that. So I’m glad to hear that there are no others, to your knowledge, that have had to close. And so I would like to request– I want to give you the time to be able to kind of source this information. One, can you confirm that no other programs have had to be closed due to staff shortages or vacancies? And then, secondly, I think you can answer this now. Just to be clear, it is your intent to restaff that Booneville program? And it is your intent to reopen and that you are in the middle of that, correct? 

Melissa Weatherton Yes, sir. 

Representative Ryan Rose And so the second question that I want to give you time to answer as well, can you get us an answer back on an estimated time for that, now that you are restaffing it and get some timelines, but the actual estimated time for that to reopen as well? 

Melissa Weatherton Yes, sir. 

Representative Ryan Rose All right. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Representative Johnson. 

Representative Lee Johnson Yeah, and I think I understand. I just want to restate it to make sure I’m clear. So you’re telling us that there are 200 vacant positions that are budgeted that need to be filled at the HDCs. You’ve currently created these budgeted positions now. They’re within your 1,960. 

And you’re telling me that we have ample applicants for those positions. These are nonlicensed positions. I’m assuming the workforce issue is, I mean, not equally divided, right? You’re telling us that we have lots of applicants because the pay plan is working, which is great. But I’m assuming that’s in the nonlicensed positions, not in the RN, LPN positions. Is that correct? 

Melissa Weatherton That’s correct. 

Representative Lee Johnson Okay. So and you’re telling me you have the budgeted money to fill those positions. So is the rate limiting step really just procedural at this point and not workforce or dollars? Is that correct? 

Melissa Weatherton I’m checking my math really quick. 

Representative Lee Johnson Yeah. 

Melissa Weatherton Hang on. 

Representative Lee Johnson Math is really hard. 

Melissa Weatherton Because I’m doing it over here on paper. I’m going to go back on that 200. I think it’s probably more about 150. 

Representative Lee Johnson Okay, but conceptually you have some open positions. The rate limiting step to filling those open positions is not applicants and it’s not you don’t have the money. You’re not going to have to go to some other places and rearrange the deck chairs and lay people off to hire these people somewhere else within DDS. You’ve got the money. You’ve got the workforce there. It’s truly just working through the procedure that has been introduced with the new pay plan. 

Melissa Weatherton Yes, but I will double check that. I will say that when somebody that’s not an HDC employee at DDS leaves, we’re not backfilling it. We’re focusing all of our efforts on filling the HDC. 

Representative Lee Johnson I would just echo what Senator Johnson said. You know, it sounds like it’s a good problem we’ve created. It sounds like we have historically had unbudgeted positions because we just didn’t have anybody applying. So why would we change that? Because we’ve never had anybody apply. It sounds like the pay plan is working, which is great. 

We’re getting the applicants, but I would think that we’ve historically budgeted the same as you’ve historically planned for non-budgeted positions, right? As a legislative body, we’ve given you enough money that you historically needed based on the rate at which you could fill the job. So it’s hard for me to envision that we haven’t shortchanged you a little, not out of any ill will or intent, but just because maybe we as a legislative body underestimated the number of jobs that the pay plan was going to bring in, right? 

And so if there is a need to adjust the budget to try to meet the demand that the pay plan has created appropriately, then I would encourage that to be brought out in the budget hearings so that we can make that accommodation. Because I think everybody here wants to try to take care of this population of people. 

Melissa Weatherton Thank you. 

Representative Lee Johnson Thank you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw So wait a minute. But that’s not what you just said. 

Melissa Weatherton When? Sorry. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw So if you had enough money and you had plenty of budget, then why are you not filling that position back at DDS? And why are you taking that position dollars and putting it towards the facility? Because that’s what I heard you just say. And am I missing something? 

Melissa Weatherton We still have to stay within our budget. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw True, but you don’t have enough budget right now to fill every budgeted position you have in the HDCs, correct? 

Melissa Weatherton I would have to go back and talk to the CFO and double check that. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Okay, but you just answered his question and said that if somebody left DDS you would use that position to fill a position in the human development centers or in the facilities. Is that not what you just told him? 

Melissa Weatherton Yeah, and that is true. And it’s tight. We’re really watching it. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw There ain’t enough money. So saying that is an incorrect statement. And leading legislators to believe we put enough money there is not the way this needs to leave. It needs more money to fill those budgeted positions. And I can’t go to bed tonight knowing that we didn’t tell the true story. I just can’t do it. I’m sorry. 

And if we’re taking a position from the department and filling the positions over at HDCs, it’s a budget problem. And I’m not trying to put you in a bad position, but it’s true. It’s a budget problem. So saying that we had enough money is not an accurate statement. And using the questions to say that, it’s just not correct. 

Yes, because of the pay plan, we do have more applicants. But having more applicants but not having more positions we can fill, it doesn’t matter. Senator Love, you’re recognized.

Senator Fred Love Thank you, Mr. Chair. I was actually on the same line as Representative Wardlaw. So I want to ask you this. So you said, just for clarification, that this summer you were actually transitioning people to budgeted positions. So are you completely done with that? So there’s no more unbudgeted positions that you have? 

Jennifer Brezee We are. We’re caught up now. 

Senator Fred Love Okay, so all your positions are budgeted? 

Melissa Weatherton No, no, no, no, no, no. So, again, we get authorized positions and then we go in to PBAS, which Tony kindly told me what it meant on this piece of paper– Planning, Budgeting, and Administrative System. We go in every single year and we budget and unbudget based on the money that were awarded for each division. So there’s still unbudgeted positions in that system, and there’s budgeted positions in that system. We’re only utilizing the budgeted side. 

Senator Fred Love Okay. How do we pay for the unbudgeted positions? 

Melissa Weatherton I’m so sorry, I did not hear you. 

Senator Fred Love How do we pay for the unbudgeted positions? 

Melissa Weatherton We do not. When we unbudget, then we do not have to pay the insurance or the fringe on those positions. They’re just kind of on hold in the system. 

Senator Fred Love So I guess I’m not asking my question correctly. So you have people that are in budgeted positions, unbudgeted positions. You have people that are in unbudgeted positions. 

Melissa Weatherton Not right now. 

Senator Fred Love Okay, so you don’t have any more unbudgeted positions? 

Melissa Weatherton No, sir. 

Senator Fred Love All of them are in budgeted positions? 

Melissa Weatherton Yes. 

Senator Fred Love Great. Now you said there was 150 or so positions that need to be filled across the state? 

Melissa Weatherton So we have 1,965 budgeted positions. And we have 1,726 staff at the HDCs. And we have around 101 non-HDC staff running the waivers and PASSE and programs and all those programs. So we have 102. So right now we have 1,828 budgeted positions filled, and we can go up to 1,965. 

Senator Fred Love Okay. So will by completing that to 1,965, you will have enough funding. But is that enough, do you have enough? Is that going to meet your capacity, your need, I guess? So when you fill all those positions, is that going to meet your capacity? Do you get what I’m asking? 

Melissa Weatherton I think we will still have to utilize some of the– think we’ll still be utilizing the contracts. 

Senator Missy Irvin So define the 1,965 is not just HDCs, correct? 

Melissa Weatherton It’s DDS. 

Senator Missy Irvin It’s DDS. Okay. So 1,965 is all employees at DDS. So that is your authorized number that you have to stay within, 1,965. So you’re trying to shift people to hire at HDCs and not hire at DDS because you’re trying to maintain that cap of 1,965. 

Melissa Weatherton Yes. 

Senator Missy Irvin But also you’re trying to maintain the budgeted amount of money that you have to pay all those people under the new pay plan. 

Melissa Weatherton Yes. 

Senator Missy Irvin And so, do you see what I’m saying? I didn’t mean to interrupt you. I just wanted to make sure that we were clear about 1,965 isn’t just at HDC. 

Senator Fred Love Yeah, but that’s fine. And that’s where my question was leading. Will you have the capacity as an agency in HDCs, will you have the capacity that you need to actually, under this pay plan, under this 1,965 number, does that capacity meet what you need? 

Melissa Weatherton I mean, I think it’s going to substantially help. And I think we can reevaluate when we hit that. And several of y’all have offered to have further discussions about this, which I appreciate. But I think if we can get to that number, we would then reevaluate. 

Senator Fred Love Okay. All right. Thank you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Members, just remember we still have two members of the public that want to testify on this subject. Representative Barnes, you’re recognized. 

Representative Glenn Barnes Thank you, Chair. Considering your turnover rate that you’re having, is that, the first question, is that normal? Has that been normal that you have this turnover rate? Is this normal for you all? 

Melissa Weatherton It is, unfortunately. 

Representative Glenn Barnes Okay. Are you all putting in any systems in place and maybe to find a way to retain people and keep them longer? 

Melissa Weatherton So actually several years ago, you guys at the General Assembly passed a bill that mandated that we do a 360 degree review on the HDCs to determine if we could pinpoint what exactly was going on that was causing the turnover, right? Is it more than pay, right? Because we were hearing, a lot of it has to do with your direct supervisor. 

So we had a contractor come in and do a full evaluation. And they, at the end of it, set up this retention recruitment campaign called We Heart. And so the five HDCs have been utilizing this recruitment retention platform, I would say, for the last two years. And that’s what Director Brezee was saying. We send a report to you guys, I think, quarterly on how that is going. Annually. Annually, thank you. The turnover is high. But I mean, this is kind of hard to believe. Before we put We Heart in, it was higher. 

So I think with the campaign, it’s a big employee recognition campaign and the staff really like it. So I’m hopeful that with the recognition campaign that we have been utilizing plus the increase in pay, thanks to the pay plan, that we will see those numbers go down. 

Representative Glenn Barnes Do we have access to that plan? 

Melissa Weatherton We can get it for you. 

Representative Glenn Barnes I’d like to see it. Thank you. 

Senator Missy Irvin Thank you. Also, if you’re a legislator, you could raise your hand if you’ve ever been to the Blue Umbrella. Raise your hand. Or if you’ve bought gifts from the Blue Umbrella. Good. So it’s a wonderful place. We’re going to go to our witnesses. Yep, yes. Representative Ladyman, you’re recognized. 

Representative Jack Ladyman Thank you, Madam Chair. Representative Barnes, that’s a good question you ask. And this program that they’re talking about, you can go to an HDC, and I would recommend that some of y’all go there and tour. And there’s a form that you can fill out. This is just common sense in the business industry. 

And one of the things that they’ve implemented a few years ago is you can fill out a sheet of paper and comment on how good a person is doing their job at the HDC. They get recognition, they have employee of the month, those kind of things. It’s a really good program, but if you’re around an HDC and want to go in there and see it and fill out a form, I would recommend it. 

Senator Missy Irvin Thank you for that. Okay, we’re going to move. Thank you, ladies. Katrina Robertson. Is Katrina Robinson, Robertson, if you’ll come up? And Terry Johnson, I think. Do you want to do individually or come together? I’ll let you choose. Okay, whatever you would like. If you’ll just both want to come up at the same time, that’ll be fine. And then if you’ll just state your names, please, and who you’re with or who you’re representing, then we’ll let you guys proceed. So we have Katrina Robertson and Terry Johnson. I have you both listed as parents. And then I’ll let you describe the organization that you have listed here. Thank you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw One second. DHS Department, don’t run off. I do have a question for you guys when the witnesses are done. 

Advocates for HDC Residents

Katrina Robertson My name’s Katrina Robertson. I’m mom to Noah. He’s 22 years old, and he’s been a resident at the Booneville Human Development Center for three and a half years now. I’m also president of the FFCR Friends and Family of Care Facility residents for the Booneville chapter. Terry here’s the president for the state. And we just work to advocate for the needs of the profoundly disabled. 

I can tell you that Booneville Human Development Center has been a godsend to Noah and our family, life-giving in every sense of the word. Some of the most dedicated and compassionate, passionate people that I’ve ever met work there. And I’m here today because I’m deeply concerned about the staffing and hiring challenges all of the HDCs are facing. But you’ve heard Booneville mentioned many times. 

I mean, we’re making something confusing that is not confusing. You know, the HDC budgets have been flat for, I don’t want to give a number of years, but I want to say a decade. So we are trying to pay the same number of people a higher amount of pay based on last year’s budget. Anyway, I don’t know why that has not been addressed more specifically. 

Now, so Noah, he’s intellectually disabled. He functions at about a three to four year old level, but he’s very, very verbal and he keeps up with all gossip on the hill, as we affectionately call Booneville. And he calls me with the latest gossip all the time. And he called two weeks ago and he said, Mama, I don’t have a job anymore. And I said, What do you mean you don’t have a job? He says, I don’t have a job. And I said, Well, why do you not have a job? 

And he says, They don’t have workers for us. And there’s been several times where you have multiple employees call in. There’s sicknesses that go around and they’ve got to kind of rearrange daily schedules. And I said, Well, I bet you’ll go to work next week. And he says, No, no, there’s no more work, Mama. I must stay in my room and watch TV and sometimes go play games, but I need more of my word searches. He can do word searches all day. 

So obviously I was concerned. So I reached out to an administrator who confirmed that the vocational and training areas had been closed indefinitely so staff could be reassigned to the direct care roles. And it was due to the ongoing difficulty and delays in filling the open positions. You know, many of y’all know that I’m a strong advocate for HDCs, not just on the state level but on the federal level. In two weeks, I’ll be back in Washington, DC, meeting with all of our federal delegates.

 As I stated, Noah’s job, his job at Booneville is making rugs. I was in DC in May and I had brought all six of our delegates a rug as a gift. Senator Tom Cotton loved the rug so much that he had his legislative assistant reach out to me here recently, and she said, Cotton would like to purchase 55 of your largest rugs in red and green that he wants to gift to the other senators as kind of a showcase work done by a 14C program. 

However, when I tried to coordinate the order last week, I learned that the vocational program’s closure meant there was no way to fulfill this order. The staff member I spoke with was thrilled about this request, of course, but disheartened to explain that the only way to fill it would be just to use rugs that are in stocks. She wouldn’t be able to accommodate the specific request. 

But she also shared that what exacerbated the problem is that many of those workers who had been transitioned to other areas have since left Booneville Human Development Center because of their frustration with the situation, which created an even more severe problem. I will make the statement that the statement was made that all requested positions are being approved. 

That is not what I hear. I’m not going to speak as far as names and statements and numbers of requests versus what’s approved because it would be hearsay. Really, who you would need to speak with are the people requesting positions and how that’s working. Friends, this situation is dire. But, overall, budgets must increase to sustain those pay raises and to have proper support and staffing levels. 

The question was asked: Are we meeting licensure requirements? That, really, I don’t think has ever been anything they’ve even gotten close to. But as already has been addressed, these individuals require much more care than the bare minimum, many of them one on one. You know, this vulnerable population, they depend on us and we can’t allow them to go without appropriate staff or the ability to have things like a job that make them proud. 

Terry Johnson I’m Terry Johnson. I’m the president of our parent guardian advocacy group for the state of Arkansas. And Katrina covered a lot of the main items. But in my position as the president, I get the most unbelievable phone calls and texts all the time from parents who say, my kid needs more staff in there, there’s nobody there, they didn’t pack his bag correctly when I came to to pick him up, to really more serious things that I don’t even want to go into here. But I got an outrageously serious call this week. 

But it’s these houses that we’re talking about here where my son lives, where her son lives, can’t go without staff people. My friend back here has a hotel, he likened it the other day. He said, you know, when my house cleaner on the fourth floor of my hotel quits, it’s not like I can close down the fourth floor. I have to get somebody in there no matter what I have to do. I have to get somebody in there to clean that floor. 

Well, when staff people leave a house and you’re under license requirements and so forth, you have to have somebody qualified and with the patients to deal with the folks that are in there because nobody could possibly love their son more than me. But he got to the point where I couldn’t handle him on a regular basis. But the HDC has been a miracle. They handle him very, very well. He loves it there. He calls it his college. 

I would do anything for those HDCs. And I also say I would do almost anything for the two ladies that spoke up here earlier. Both of them have helped me in past years with outrageous problems. So I have nothing against them. But I must say I have the feeling, no proof, not under testimony here, but I bet they are under some restrictions that we could not possibly imagine. 

Because if you really talk to these people, if you talk to the caseworkers and the staff people and the superintendents at these places, that’s where you get the real story. And I’m going to get in huge trouble for saying this, but this is just the way that I have to do it. If you all wanted to get the absolute, bona fide true answers– because I’m an MBA and I had a hard time following all of the budgeted and unbudgeted stuff that we had. I couldn’t follow. 

But if you ever want the true answers, call in the five superintendents that run these five centers. And have them in a position where they don’t have to worry about their job. They are petrified to talk about how bad the problems really are because they’re scared for their job. And I think that is wrong. They should be able to, and again, they’re doing their job. You know, they are doing what they’re being told to do. 

But here, you guys have the link to people even above where they’re reporting to. And that’s what I’m getting at. If these handicapped folks that are citizens of this state, there’s not that many. We’re talking 850 or so. That’s a very small percentage of the population. They need the help. They need the budget. Talk to these superintendents. Let them tell you, this is how we’ve tried to make lemonade out of lemons for a long time. Their budgets have been flat, like Katrina said. They do need more money, but everybody’s been trained, God, don’t ask for more money. Don’t ever ask for more money. 

Well, when this new hiring policy came and said, Well, we’re going to give you the rate, you can now hire these nurses that are going to work for hospitals and other places because it’s more competitive. Well, now they got a lot of applicants. Yeah, man, now you raised the price, I think $11 an hour to 18 or something. They got a lot. But then there’s no money to pay them with. And if they do come in, they have to go through a five-week approval process. And then a training process and then the approvals. 

Unlike what they seem to indicate, the approvals are not coming. People are on vacation. Well, we’ll get to you in a couple weeks. I go back to my buddy with the hotel. When you have staff people leave these house and you’ve got 15, 20 high-risk individuals in there, you can’t sit there and say, Well, all y’all go home. When we get the right staff, you can come back. We gotta have somebody right then to take that place. That’s an emergency situation. We have to have that. 

I don’t know anything about when she said the 200 people or the 150. I don’t know what that means. But if you ask the five superintendents, they wouldn’t have any clue what that means because they’re sitting there waiting on resources to come. And they’re not coming. And it’s a problem. And it’s finally gotten to the problem where they didn’t even care if they risk their job. They had said, we gotta get some help. So if y’all are advocating for us, please go down there to Little Rock and tell the powers that be that somebody– I mean, we’ve always lived on the very lowest of budget, and we still will if we have to. 

But we’ve gone beyond that now. Now we’ve gotten to where we might jeopardize the license requirements of some of these homes and some of the things that have to happen. Even these superintendents have licenses that are at risk if they allow stuff like this to happen. So God bless, I mean, those five superintendents have wings on them. They’re the most wonderful people in the world. And so are these two ladies back here. They’re trying to do something that’s almost impossible. 

But if you really want real answers, then ask those five people. And probably they wouldn’t give you a wish list of everything under the sun. They would just give you a wish list of just enough to get by, what I need to have. And you could get straight answers there. I don’t know if that will ever happen, but that’s where all the answers lie. So forgive me if I went off. And I probably was not allowed to even say that. But please ask them because they have it. 

Senator Missy Irvin Thank you for your testimony. You’re allowed to say whatever you want to say. You are a citizen of the state of Arkansas and you’re before the Arkansas legislature. You have a right to say whatever you want to say under the constitution of the United States. 

Terry Johnson My heart is with those five superintendents. 

Senator Missy Irvin We understand. 

Terry Johnson Because if they weren’t taking care of my son, I wouldn’t have a life, and my family wouldn’t have a life. They are doing an impossible job. 

Senator Missy Irvin Yes, sir. 

Terry Johnson Just walk into one of those places one time. You have to be half angel to work there. It’s a tough job. And when one or two leave because they can’t take it anymore or don’t have the money, they we have to get them replaced. And so they are wonderful people. These are wonderful people. This is a hard job we’re trying to do. 

The answer comes from above, way above me, probably way above them. This comes from the people that y’all work with, I guess. And how important is it? These HDCs and the folks that are in there, is that where we need to put our money? Maybe we need to put it in a highway instead, or maybe we need to do something else. I don’t know. That’s up to the people a lot smarter than me. 

But I hope that we will see the importance of these 850 people in these HDCs. And God bless y’all for letting parents like us come in front of you and talk talk openly. 

Senator Missy Irvin Absolutely. 

Terry Johnson We’ll do anything we can to help. Our group, we’re unpaid, we’re volunteers. We’ve been doing this for about since 2012, 2011 or something like that. And we’re here to help in any way we can. 

Senator Missy Irvin Appreciate you. 

Terry Johnson Thank you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Representative Ladyman, do you have something for the witnesses? 

Representative Jack Ladyman Yeah, I’d like to ask one question if that’s okay. Am I on here? Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Terry, good to see you. I hadn’t seen you in a while. Talk to you on the phone. Thank you for being here, Katrina. Carol, thank you for being here. You’re not at the table, but appreciate you being here. 

Katrina Robertson I think Carol’s watching virtually. 

Representative Jack Ladyman Terry, just want to let you know Family Day was Saturday in Jonesboro. I had lunch with your son. He ate his barbecue, didn’t drop any of it. He was good. He did a great job. 

Terry Johnson It’s the first one I’ve missed in 15 years. 

Representative Jack Ladyman No, you couldn’t be there, but he did good. But you talk about the superintendents and I think you’re absolutely right. And Mr. Chairman, I would like to recommend that we have the superintendents at our next meeting and talk to them. Most people know I’m a boots on the ground guy and I want to know what’s going on, boots on the ground. 

And I think it would be a good idea to talk to those folks. And also I talked to one superintendent. I won’t say which one, but that superintendent got called in and had to work on third shift in a house because somebody quit. 

Terry Johnson Yeah, and the classes have been canceled. 

Representative Jack Ladyman But when you have the highest paid person at that site working third shift, whatever needs to be done in a house, there’s something wrong. So Mr. Chairman, I have a motion at the proper time. And, again, thank you all for being here. 

Katrina Robertson Thank you. 

Previous State Funding Amounts

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Seeing no further questions, thank you for your testimony. Can I get the DHS personnel back to the table, please? So one quick question before we move on on the agenda. Can you walk me through the DDS RSA amounts from 2017 to today? 

And you don’t have to go through every one of them, but just kind of highlight it. From where I’m at, and I’ve looked into the RSA amounts, you were short before the pay plan and before we even came into this year, if I’m correct. And I just want to hear it from y’all’s mouth where the RSA amounts were from 2017 to today. 

Melissa Weatherton I’m happy to go through that. I actually have it with me. Okay, so for DDS, the division, again, is not broken down by HDCs. But as you could hear, that’s where most of our money goes. So for 2017, our DDS RSA amount was 65,870,969. I’ll shoot up here to ’21. So in ’21 the DDS RSA amount was 67,782,000. And last year in 2025, it was 65,603,057. And in 2026, it’s the same 65,603,057. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw So what you’re telling me is in 2017 we were at 68 million and change. I’m not even going to try to say that big number. But we’re basically $3 million less today than we were almost 10 years ago, nine years ago if you want to be technical. 

Melissa Weatherton No, sir, I’m sorry. So in 2017 it was 65,870,969. So it’s only about what, 270? 270,000. We received 270,000 more in ’17 than ’26. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw That’s crazy. And so when it went up to 67 million, that was just through COVID? 

Melissa Weatherton Yes, sir. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Was that due to any federal programs that enhanced your funding? Or was that just due to filling gaps on staffing? 

Melissa Weatherton You guys filled gaps on staffing because everything was costing so much money. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Thank you. All right. Seeing no questions from committee members, thank you for that info. Oh, hold on. Representative Woolridge. 

Representative Jeremy Wooldridge Thank you, Mr. Chair. And that kind of made me think of a question. So when that COVID bump took your budget up to 67, what changes took place that we then had to try to either cut or are we trying to maintain those? Was there expanded positions? What happened with that additional funding? 

Melissa Weatherton We just had to so heavily move towards contracts at that time. And then of course we were getting all of the required PPE to try to keep people healthy. So it was just a lot of added expenses back then that I think the General Assembly recognized and knew that we needed more state general revenue to meet those needs back then. 

Representative Jeremy Wooldridge Okay. I guess I didn’t ask my question well. I’m sorry. So did we address one time fixes with the bump in Covid funds or did we increase pay or do things that were going to be a residual recurring expense? 

Melissa Weatherton So I will say, over the last 10 years, we have implemented two pretty extensive pay plans at the HDCs that many of y’all probably remember, the last one being we actually require now CNAs. And we set up CNA schools so that we could pay people more. So yeah, year over year we’ve been very successful of using the money that we’ve been given. 

We’ve started a CNA school. We opened a store. We’ve been building on our campuses. At DDS, we were able to absorb merit increases, right, year over year and pay increases for the CNAs and LPNs on our own accord within our own budget. I just think we’ve gotten to the point now where we can’t absorb everything anymore. Okay. 

Representative Jeremy Wooldridge Understood. Thank you for your time.  

Senator Missy Irvin Of your total funding, is it state general revenue or federal funding mix? 

Melissa Weatherton The numbers, Senator Irvin, that I just went through was just the SGR that’s in the DD that y’all give us during budget hearings each year. So that’s just the state general revenue. There’s a very high federal match at the human development centers because of the nature of the work. The other thing that’s occurring right now is, because our state is doing really well, our federal match rate is dropping. So we went down 2 percent in October. 

Senator Missy Irvin And every percentage– so I just think that members of this committee need to understand it’s always about a decision. And I think that Mr. Johnson adequately described it. We have decisions that are being made. And so with state general revenue, it’s critically important that we understand that state general revenue has actually decreased since 2017 for DDS budget– state general revenue. And the federal match has, because the state of Arkansas has done better economically, our FMAP has changed. 

And every 1 percentage change equates to $90 million hit to state general revenue. Okay? So that’s $90 million more in state general revenue that we have to put up, pay our portion, increases by 90 million at current existing service. That’s not adding anything new. That’s just price of groceries have gone up. We’re still buying milk, but the price of groceries have gone up, basically. 

So I say all that because Medicaid and DHS, DDS, the funding is critical for us to understand it in the perspective of everything else that is coming our way. So when a program that is being federally funded by 100% because of COVID loses federal money, you have to understand what you’re asking of everybody else when you’re asking for state general revenue now to fill the gap of a federal deficit of federal funding. The people that suffer are these people. Okay? But federal money has gone away because of COVID money. Federal money went away. 

So we as a legislature have to make a decision about who’s going to be the winners and who’s going to be losers. So when you lose federal funding for programs that are very good programs, you always have to have the perspective as a legislator to understand, well, the state general revenue for this DDS agency has remained, not just flat, but actually decreased. So now we’re way behind the buck. And I’m sorry I’m on a soapbox, but I am very passionate about public health in the state of Arkansas. I’m passionate about everything else too. 

But at one point, at some point, you, as a legislator, me as well, we all have to look at this as a perspective and understand our funding and understand state general revenue versus federal revenue and where we’re going to actually backfill. And if we do backfill a completely 100% federal program with a new state GR and we’re already behind in this area, more suffering takes place for these people. These people may win, but these people are going to lose. Okay, so 69.23 percent is paid for by federal funding. Okay. And that’s going to 67? Or it’s at 69. It was at 71 and now it’s gone down to 69. Okay, thank you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Thank you, Senator. Seeing no further questions, Representative Ladyman, I want to hear your motion. I’m not saying I’m taking it yet, but go ahead. 

Representative Jack Ladyman Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Well, it’s been a good discussion. And I have to say, because we’re getting less federal money, it means that our economy is doing better and we’re paying our own way. I don’t think that’s a bad thing. I think it’s good that we are able to take care of our own people and not take money from California. But anyway, that’s another subject. 

Mr. Chairman, I believe with all this discussion that there’s an issue here that we need to make a motion to correct. I believe there’s a timing issue with these direct care individuals. And I think if we can speed that process up even a little bit, it will help these HDCs. So here’s my motion. I move to exempt direct care vacant positions at the human development centers from the new hiring procedure. That’s my motion. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Getting an answer from legal and then I’ll come back to you. Okay. Members– yeah, go ahead. 

Senator Missy Irvin So as we’re asking for more information on his motion, I’d like to know, yes or no, if this Joint Public Health Committee has the authority to do that. If we do not, does that authority exist at another committee level, perhaps through ALC or Budget? Is that okay? Okay, thank you. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Representative Ladyman, we’re going to move on through the agenda while we’re waiting to hear back from legal, but we’ll come back to your questions. So I’m going to table it at the moment, without objection. And as we get that determination from legal, we’ll come back and take it up. So with that, we’ll recognize– oh, you’re at the table. You guys are good. So we’ll go ahead and recognize y’all for the substance abuse and mental health rule. If you would, have the new team members introduce themselves for the record. 

Melissa Weatherton Yes, sir. 

Martina Smith Morning. Martina Smith, Director for the Division of Provider Services and Quality Assurance. 

Paula Stone Paula Stone, Office of Substance Abuse and Mental Health, DHS.  

Substance Abuse and Mental Health Rule

Melissa Weatherton And Melissa Weatherton, Director for Medicaid Specialty Populations. Okay, thank you. So we are here on this topic. So Act 636, which was an act that was passed in this last legislative session that made several changes to psychiatric residential treatment facilities, and it, at the time, that bill had an emergency clause on it. So the three of us went and ran a set of emergency rules that went into effect on June 20. 

And what we have before you today is the permanent rules that we are seeking to put in place to regulate psychiatric residential treatment facilities, which are called PRTFs. So we have Miss Martina Smith. As she introduced herself, she is over our division that does all licensure certification and our office of long-term care. And then of course, Ms. Stone is our behavioral health commissioner for the state of Arkansas. She’s over the Office of Substance Abuse and Mental Health. 

So out of both of these divisions came a manual. So we have an Office of Long-Term Care Licensure Manual for PRTFs that will be regulated underneath Ms. Smith’s OLTC unit. And then we have the corresponding Medicaid manual that sets out what we think is the standard of care that’s to be provided that falls under Miss Stone’s unit. So that’s why we’re all three up here today. I’ll hit on some high notes. We feel like we have made some good changes. 

We actually got two public comments back that we were happy to see were pretty complimentary. Like they’re not happy with everything, but we agree this is a good start. We also responded back that we had committed to putting these rules in place for six months and then reevaluating if we need to do stuff differently. 

And so that’s what we responded to on the public comments. So we appreciate that feedback. We also, just to know, we got really good feedback from BLR on things that we had missed. And so we were able to go in and make some of those changes too. So we appreciate that. I think the high notes are, prior to this law, the psychiatric residential treatment facilities were being licensed by a board. And the board is called Child Welfare Agency Review Board. And at the time, that board, this was the only program that was paid for by Medicaid that they were licensing. 

So they primarily do our foster care homes, our adoption homes. But PRTF previously was being licensed by this board. And so now they are licensed as a long-term care facility just like a human development center, ICF, just like a nursing home, highly regulated, required to have an administrator. We changed the age of admission. Previously you could go to a PRTF if you were 5. It’s now raised to 10. So there’s no new admissions after age 10. 

We put restrictions in place that you cannot share a bedroom if you’re outside of a 3-year age range. And so that is now in here. We banned any type of seclusion. We have banned any type of mechanical restraint. And we are requiring monthly reports so we can see what’s going on. We are requiring a psychotrophic drug report each month, discharge reporting each month. We want reports on out of state children each month, and then any type of restraint. We’re getting restraint reports on a monthly basis. 

The PRTF providers have been very engaged with us over the last several months on this work. We might not have always agreed, but we collaborated. And it has been, I think, a very good working relationship. And we look forward to you guys approving these rules. And let us know if you have any questions. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Seeing no questions, without objection, they stand reviewed. 

Melissa Weatherton Thanks. 

Representative Jeff Wardlaw Committee, the other item on the agenda was pulled by the department. Seeing no other business, we stand adjourned.