House Transportation Committee
January 28, 2025
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:00:01] You go ahead and you may proceed and bring any witnesses you wish on your bill. Anyone else here to speak for or against the bill, make sure you sign in this morning. Thank you. Well, are we still able to record if he's not? Can you still hear him? If you speak loud, we'll go ahead and proceed. It's a big, big agenda.
Representative Aaron Pilkington [00:01:26] Thank you to everyone. Thank you, Mr. Chair, for recognizing me. I'm Representative Aaron Pilkington, District 45, presenting House Bill 1046. This is actually a piece of legislation [comments off-mic] Quick way and brief way to do it. But really, the benefits is it helps officers recognize that the driver may have a disability that affects their behavior, such as difficulty making eye contact or responding to commands.
It also reduces anxiety for the drivers by giving them a clear tool to explain their situation without having to verbally communicate under stress, which sometimes is difficult with those with autism. It provides awareness and training for law enforcement about interacting with these individuals with the disability.
So there's a few other states that have already done this. Massachusetts, California, New York, Rhode Island, Vermont, Maine, all have similar programs in place. If we were to do this, we would be the first state in the South to have this program. But I'll say as someone who, I serve on a board that deals with those with DD and BH issues, I know that this would be a big service to them and a big help.
And so I know this population supports this legislation and I'm glad to be a champion for them here today. But I would like to turn it over to my guests and let them introduce themselves and explain who they are and why they think this is a necessary piece of legislation.
Ludwick Kozlowski [00:03:45] Hi, my name is Ludwick Kozlowski. I am a self advocate on the autism spectrum, and I am from North Little Rock, Arkansas.
Logan Collins [00:03:58] Good morning. My name is Logan Collins. I am employed as a truck driver hauling fuel and I also have autism. I am from Jacksonville, Arkansas, and I really appreciate y'all having me here today to share my story.
Ludwick Kozlowski [00:04:14] So I will happily share my story. In 2004, I was working at the Pine Bluff Arsenal. It was a late night and I just wanted to get home from a late day's work. I was driving on the military post. It was a hot July evening. I was in the back part of the post leaving. It was dark, woods in the back area, and there were three deer that sprinted out of nowhere crossing the street. There were two baby deer that sprinted right in front of my car, barely missed the front of it.
And out of nowhere, there was this big parent deer that sprinted and smashed right inside, right to the side of my front passenger window. Had this face against my window splattered right on the side of the road. It shook me up. It drove me into anxiety. I looked out. I was flat on its side. Door was smashed. I was fine.
But I drove to the post exit when I was informed that they were going to have to get an officer to go back with me to the scene to do a report. I was quite nervous. I tried to keep my composure. We get to the scene and the deer that was on the side of the road was no longer there. We get out. He gets out of his pad, starts asking standard questions. You know, what time did this happen? And then we got to the question. In the meantime, my brain is just overwhelmed. There's a lot of sensory stimuli and everything.
One of the questions that next came up was, were there any other witnesses? I answered him and I said there were two other deer and they ran into the woods. And he just looked at me like, cut the nonsense out, and just stared at me. And he goes, Excuse me. And I looked at him and I got a little bit firmer in my language and I said there were two other deer and they ran into the woods. And he just looked at me and he just started making a face and he just kept going, luckily. It did bother me. It made me feel like, Why are you not believing me? Luckily, we got through the incident and nothing happened. But I didn't know what to think. I felt I wasn't believed.
And it ruminated with me and bothered me. And the next day, when I come down, I realized, Did I say that? Bottom line is, when we are in situations, whether we are stopped by the cop, I'm speaking for myself, there's a lot of sensory overload and there are things we take literally. And having a program like this would very much help remind us and help the cop understand. It's very important how language is phrased.
It would remind the individual on the spectrum what they need to do, what they would have, having that emergency contact, it would help de-escalate situations. It would bring also what it would be called neutral inclusivity into the discussion so that there's de-escalation and a calmness and so that nothing bad would happen or misunderstanding would happen. You know, I love cops and how they do their jobs. But just making sure there's that good barrier so that there's keeping the peace and nothing can go wrong and just keeping that great relationship in the community.
So that's why I believe this bill is necessary. I know many peers who would love for this to happen. And it just is great common sense to have something like this. And so that's why I'm here to discuss this today. And I'll happily take any questions.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:08:56] Thank you for your testimony. Mr. Collins, you go ahead and give you your testimony. And then if we have questions, we'll do that after you. Go ahead.
Logan Collins [00:09:04] All right. Thank you for having me here today. And I want to reach out and thank Aaron Pilkington as well for inviting me. My hope for this bill is the understanding that police officers are professionals and all professionals need good information to be able to do their jobs efficiently. And so my hope is that by having this blue envelope program, we can have the information to help the officer understand how they might be able to better go through what needs to be done.
And my story happened in July of last year. I had a load of fuel going to exit 216. The Road Ranger. It was 66,000 gallons of diesel for Cotton Pant, Brinkley. And there was a wreck on the side of I-40 at that time. And I had tried to get over, but nobody would let me over. And it's difficult to get a 60 foot long vehicle over sometimes if the cars aren't willing to cooperate. And I got pulled over by the police officer and I pulled over. And I felt like there was a lot of times in that situation where there was a communication gap, like they didn't understand my language. And kind of body language is different than what they might be used to.
And I felt like something like the blue envelope could help them understand, you know, it could have gone a lot smoother. And I feel like communication barriers could have been removed. And so my hope is that with this law, somebody else could have an easier time. For example, like me, diagnosed with autism, could have an easier time, and officers could have an easier time because there could be more communication and more understanding from both sides.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:10:54] Thank you, Mr. Collins. You ready to take questions? Representative Richmond. I think I shut you off. Hold on a minute. Press the button again. Okay, So you're good.
Representative Marcus Richmond [00:11:12] Thank you, Mr. Chair. Representative Pilkington. Thank you for bringing this. I think that you're onto something here. And thank you, gentlemen, that came here and shared their testimony. My question is, How is an individual with autism initially identified that they have this issue that they're dealing with so that we can get the blue envelopes? I don't know if there's something during the initial process of getting your license or something like that. Do you have an answer that can help me understand how this process is going to work?
Representative Aaron Pilkington [00:11:45] Sure. So I had a few other representatives come up to me with a very similar question. How would someone essentially qualify? I could just walk into a revenue office and say, Hey, I need a blue envelope. That's not explicitly in this bill. I was leaving up to DFA to make those rules. I would imagine during the interim with ALC and the rule making process that we would essentially say, you need to come in with a doctor's note or some sort of diagnosis to prove that have a diagnosis of autism to qualify for this program.
So that would be the way to do it. But you know how it is. You put things in statue and then in two years, we're having to change it because maybe it wasn't as clear. We didn't do it the right way. So I wanted to leave it open to DFA to kind of create those rules for us in the interim to promulgate them and approve those.
Representative Marcus Richmond [00:12:31] Thank you. Follow up? As far as, do the individuals now, and anybody can answer this question, that when you get your driver's license or you get your trucking license, whatever it is that you're having, is there something where you identify yourself as having autism during that process?
Ludwick Kozlowski [00:12:59] My understanding from a support group I run for adults on the autism spectrum is there is something you can get on your license plate that indicates you could have communication challenges. I did not know about that until this year. It's not well publicized. And speaking from my opinion because I was not aware of it, I think there needs to be better communication on that.
That said, I do think, though, having something like a blue envelope packet is still very important because when you are on the autism spectrum, all of the sensory overload you face with flashing lights, sirens, people coming up to you, noises it can, you know, if you're not on the spectrum and it affects people in different ways, it could feel like a drill is going into your head and can be very uncomfortable and it can result in different reactions to different people, like arms swelling or movement.
Different people are going to have different reactions. And so having this with that material in there and even guidance on the back for the cop and for the person would be very helpful to have them grounded. But to answer your question, supposedly, there is something you can get. I am speaking for myself, speaking for myself. I was not aware of it and I don't think it's very well publicized. My understanding is not everybody, even at the revenue office from this person got it, was aware of it. So that's my answer to that.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:14:40] Let me bring Alicia from DFA and let's kind of clear this up. See where we are at with that. And then, if you would introduce yourself and go ahead and give us any inputs you might have to help us with this.
Alicia Austin Smith [00:14:56] Thank you, Mr. Chair, members of the committee. I'm Alicia Johnson Smith. I'm the chief counsel for the Revenue Division of DFA. I'll try to speak to what's already been spoken to. Yes, DFA issued a fiscal impact statement. You should have that in your packet. We would work with everyone to create the Blue Envelope program. We would enforce the bill as written. So as written an individual would be able to come to any revenue office and state that they have autism spectrum disorder and request a blue envelope and they would be provided that envelope upon request.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:15:29] Do you have any more questions, Representative Richmond?
Representative Marcus Richmond [00:15:31] Yeah, I think I asked the question and made it more complicated than the answer I'm actually looking for. And I apologize for that. But okay, I am 16 years old and I go in and get my license for the first time and I have autism. Is there something that identifies me as having autism during that process?
Alicia Austin Smith [00:15:55] So there are certainly, not speaking about the blue envelope program, which doesn't speak to that, there is a special license plate where those individuals bring in their doctors certification that enables them to obtain the special license plate with the decal.
Representative Marcus Richmond [00:16:10] Okay. All right. Thank you. I appreciate that answer. And I'll just say that I don't think that's a substitute for what you're trying to do now with the blue envelope thing. And I appreciate the information that you provided. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:16:24] You, sir. Thank you. Representative Hawk, you're recognized for a question.
Representative RJ Hawk [00:16:28] Thank you, Mr. Chair. Representative Pilkington. I think it's an outstanding bill. I do. My only question is, I ran a similar bill, but this was for officials last go around. And the question that always got asked to me is how do we identify or let the local law enforcement know that this is a thing? Because from both of these two gentlemen's testimony, it's been kind of more of a local issue that they've had problems with. Is there a plan in place maybe that is something you guys need to think about later on, but to get the word out to local law enforcement to let them know this program would be in place and what they're dealing with?
Representative Aaron Pilkington [00:17:02] Yeah, excellent question. I think there's two sides of this. There's the implementation of the program and then making sure people know about the program and how they interact. I mean, obviously, I know there's a lot of training, especially how to deal with individuals who have autism already. And so I assume that this would just be rolled into that training.
But additionally, you know, the governor's-- is it committee or task force? Council. Sorry. There's so many councils and committees. You guys know. But, you know, I think they have told me that they see this as a good project for them to help spread the word out and a good use of their time just to kind of help, you know, talk about this program with different law enforcement agencies across the state. And I think that's part of it, too, is the education is them working with us to make sure that they know about it and that they're aware of it coming down the line.
Representative RJ Hawk [00:17:52] Awesome. Thank you.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:17:54] Okay. Representative Duffield, you're recognized for a question.
Representative Matt Duffield [00:17:58] Thank you, sir. Representative Pilkington. One question on the envelopes. Are these just going to be a blank blue envelope or would there actually be something written on it stating what it is?
Representative Aaron Pilkington [00:18:08] Yes, there would be language written on the envelope that would state what it is.
Representative Matt Duffield [00:18:13] Thank you. I appreciate it.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:18:15] Any other questions from committee? I think we have one more to testify. Sergeant Camp from Mississippi County. Thank you, Alicia. I may call you back here in a minute.
Representative Aaron Pilkington [00:18:37] Do you want us to--
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:18:39] Pardon me.
Representative Aaron Pilkington [00:18:40] Do you want us to stay here?
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:18:41] No. You stay here. I don't think we need any more from your witnesses. Gentlemen, appreciate your testimony. Thanks for being here. Sergeant, you introduce yourself and you may proceed.
Jared Camp [00:18:54] Good morning. Thank you all for having me. I'm Sergeant Jared Camp with the Mississippi County Sheriff's Office. Currently I'm the school resource officer for the Manila School District. 2023, I was able to take some training dealing with response to citizens with autism. During this training we done a mock traffic stop on a person that had just got their license. They were on the spectrum. They just wanted to show them what it was like, how we approached the vehicle, what we asked for.
And so I approached the vehicle as normal and the citizen, the stress level was higher. Even though he knew what was going on, he still kind of froze and locked up. Well, his body language, his demeanor and his actions in the vehicle is something I would recognize, with almost 20 years experience, of somebody trying to hide something in the vehicle or being combative, just not cooperative. A lot of other officers without any training, I believe, would escalate the situation, try to get the subject out of the vehicle with them, not responding, not cooperating.
Some officers could escalate to using the taser on them for noncompliance. My fear was these individuals being hurt and that's not what we want. So I've thought about this. This is before I knew about the blue envelope. I thought about how on the driver's license they have the symbol for the handicapped. The disability symbol can be on the driver's license. My idea was to get a designated autistic symbol, kind of like the puzzle piece or something like that to put on the driver's license. That way it's more personable.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:20:47] Sergeant, we appreciate that. Let's stick with where we're at on the blue envelope bill. We appreciate your testimony, but we don't want to expand on that just yet.
Jared Camp [00:20:58] Right. I was just going along with it in case somebody that had a blue envelope lost it or was in a wreck and couldn't find it. It would be on their license. But yeah, it is a good bill. I applaud it. I think we need it. All officers in the state should be trained on how to deal with citizens with autism because it could lead to something dangerous for them if they're not compliant and officers don't know what's going on.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:21:24] Okay. Thank you for your testimony. Any questions? Representative Hall, you're recognized. Pull your mic down a little bit.
Representative Brad Hall [00:21:34] When you talk about they freeze when you walk up there and they don't act normal. And a lot of you said the autistic folks don't have a special license plate. Do you think that they need another symbol like on their window or something? So when you walk up there, they're not reaching in the glove box to get a blue envelope, which would maybe make the officer even more nervous or something like that.
Jared Camp [00:22:05] My fear with the sticker on the window and a specialized license plate is criminals are smarter than we think they are. And they will learn these license plates are specific for people with autism, and that can make them a target or more vulnerable. So that's my fear on that. That's what I thought about it was the driver's license to go along with the blue envelope.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:22:33] Okay. Representative Whitaker.
Representative David Whitaker [00:22:35] Thank you, Mr. Chair. Motion at the proper time.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:22:38] Okay. We have another question on the board. Representative Carr. Okay. Any other questions from committee? Seeing none, Representative Pilkington, are you willing to make any changes or anything to your bill or do you want to go ahead and present it as you have it written?
Representative Aaron Pilkington [00:23:05] Yes, Chairman. I'm ready to--
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:23:08] That's really a question for our freshmen. If at this time, if he wanted to, he could say, I want to pull this bill down, make a minor change to it, make an adjustment to it. The committee could let him bring it back. He could amend it, bring it back to the committee. So I'm not against this bill. I don't want you to misread what we're doing here. So DFA really has no input on this as far as being for of against it. So are you ready to close to your bill?
Representative Aaron Pilkington [00:23:43] I'm closed for my bill. Yes, sir.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:23:44] Okay. He's closed for the bill. All we need is a motion from someone on the committee. Representative Whitaker, you're recognized.
Representative David Whitaker [00:23:56] Move do pass.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:23:57] We have a do pass. We don't have to have a second on our committees. Is there any discussion? I don't see any discussion. All in favor of the motion say aye. Any opposed. Congratulations, Representative Pilkington, you passed your bill.
Representative Aaron Pilkington [00:24:15] Thank you. Thank you, committee. I appreciate it.
Representative Mike Holcomb [00:24:17] Committee, that concludes our business today. However, if you would, as soon as we adjourn, would you please meet at the steps going to the House floor so we can get our-- it's a change this year. Someone else has taken over the photographs. They don't want to do it in the committee room. They want to do it at the steps. So as soon as we leave here, would you please go to the steps to the House floor so we can get our committee picture made? Thank you. We stand adjourned.
